Login/Join to access your personalised dashboard now! Returning user? Log in or Register
Log in to your GrownUps

Politics Today

This topic contains 6673 replies, has 60 voices, and was last updated by  gabyone > 7 days ago.

Discussions Politics Today Politics Today

Viewing 10 posts - 6,111 through 6,120 (of 6,674 total)
  • #1719799
    paulinem
    Member
    Member since: July 8, 2006
    Topics: 9
    Replies: 993
    paulinem

    It was interesting in the discussion today on RNZ national of the re-election of Scott Morrison to Australian leadership/government. There was mention of a move in various election of the elections of far  right governorship. Including ( from memory ) Brazil Italy Israel and of course starting with Trump being elected in 2016. Also mention was made that the Australian  coalition  won seats where there was mining and the opposition was suggesting they be closed down. Basicly they were saying there is world wide movement to elect  far right governments. Makes you wonder if NZ will go this way in 2020 elections. I dont think so as MMP  governments will help to ensure it wont happen in NZ

    #1719805
    paulinem
    Member
    Member since: July 8, 2006
    Topics: 9
    Replies: 993
    paulinem

    Subject: Robertson’s Budget $6 Billion Short

    Finance Minister Grant Robertson’s budget later this month could have contained an additional $6 billion in spending without costing taxpayers a single cent more, Social Credit Party Leader, Chris Leitch told the party’s Canterbury Regional conference yesterday.

    But it won’t, Mr Leitch said, because the Finance Minister doesn’t understand that he could save that amount every year on interest payments on the government’s borrowing.

    Finance Ministers in Japan and China access funding from their central bank at no interest and use the money saved on interest payments to benefit their citizens.

    ! challenge him to explain why he would rather pay $6,000,000,000 dollars every year to overseas bank shareholders and PPP scheme financiers, rather than New Zealand’s  teachers, doctors, and mental health patients. Environmental projects, building roads, rail, and other infrastructure are all desperately in need of funding.

    Mr Robertson’s understanding of how the money system works is patently paper thin, and he’s relying on what advisers in Treasury, who have been sourced from the private banking industry, are telling him.

    Commercial banks create money every time they grant a loan – to individuals to buy houses or to the government.

    This has been confirmed by leading figures in the banking industry like Mervyn King, former governor of the Bank of England, and Graham Towers, former governor of the Bank of Canada, as well as local commentators like Bernard Hickey, Bryan Gaynor, Raf Manji, Shamubeel Equab, and Bryan Gould.

    The country’s central bank, the Reserve Bank, also has that power, so Mr Robertson could, and should, be accessing funding from that source.

    That would give him an additional $6 billion dollars every single year to spend on New Zealanders.

    The people of Canterbury and Kaikoura would have recovered for the natural disasters much faster had National also used the Reserve Bank to fund their recovery programmes.

    #1719814
    Hero42
    Member
    Member since: July 18, 2008
    Topics: 50
    Replies: 12018
    Hero42

    To be fair I would say it is Chris Leitch, Social Credit Party Leader, that doesn’t understand government and international finance.

    At a basic level he is probably correct in that the NZ government has to pay that much interest each year but to stop paying that interest Grant Robertson would have to find the money to repay all the money National borrowed while in power in one fell swoop which is more than the tax revenue we get each year so he wouldn’t have anything left to pay the government’s bills so he would have to borrow again.

    As it is the current government are repaying the debt in a controlled and sensible manner to reduce the interest the government has to pay but it will take time to reduce the debt burden National left us with, of which over half is estimated to be from the unaffordable tax cuts they gave to get elected in the first place.

    Cheers 🙂

    #1719816
    Hero42
    Member
    Member since: July 18, 2008
    Topics: 50
    Replies: 12018
    Hero42

    In addition it is worth noting that as the borrowing is done through Government Bonds that some of that money will have been borrowed from NZ superannuation funds that wanted to have a secure section for their conservative investments. It isn’t all from overseas banks etc.

    As to how much is borrowed from NZ investors and how much from overseas investors I do not know if we can find that information easily.

    Cheers 🙂

    #1719828
    paulinem
    Member
    Member since: July 8, 2006
    Topics: 9
    Replies: 993
    paulinem

    Hero what Chriss is saying is that the money asked for by the teachers, doctors mental health does not have to come from public funds, which you correctly said was all mostly borrowed overseas by National. Robertson can use the Reserve Bank and create the funds required. With no interest from taxpayers funds to repay this money created. As he correctly said this is how the Australian banks get the money to lend to NZers for mortgages on their over valued homes. Sadly  the money to the banks has to be paid back with real earned money, not created as the banks did to lend it to them.

    Chris is critical of the money we pay back in interest to overseas banks as this money was all created by overseas banks to lend to English/Joyce National, which was borrowed just  to make the economy/books  look good. As Chris correctly said National should have used the reserve bank, created funds  to find the money they needed and thus  we would not have  to spend so much of taxpayers funds, repaying interest on money  ie the created money we borrowed over seas.

    As long as it is done responsibly ( ie not irresponsibly like Mugabe Zimbarbwee) using created funds by the reserve bank has and is today a legitimate way of raising  necessary INTERNAL  funds without hurting or damaging the economy.

    US gets away with creating money this way as the US dollar is a desirable money in most parts of the world. By the way this is the reason US  is doing so well at present , they create money  considerably to assist their economy.

    #1719833
    halcyon
    Member
    Member since: May 4, 2014
    Topics: 8
    Replies: 4951
    halcyon

    Hero, maybe you can answer a couple of questions in respect of the Social Credit idea of the NZRB creating money as suggested by paulinem.

    1) What effect would this have on the value of the $NZ?

    2) What effect would this have on NZ’s credit rating, and there by on our current interest rates?

    It's ok if you disagree with me. I can't force you to be right.

    #1719837
    paulinem
    Member
    Member since: July 8, 2006
    Topics: 9
    Replies: 993
    paulinem

    Halycon the Australian  banks are enjoying record profits, creating money has had no problem on their credit rating so why should effect our own economy if we did the same as the bank and  responsibly created credit for our internal expenses and costs.

    Micky Savage did this back in the 1930s and got the country out of the depression and paid for the costs of sending a military support to England in 1939 Since then  successive govt did this as we operated an economy of hands on Govt control.

    Unfortunately in 1984 Roger Douglas took the Govt controls off the economy and gave it to private people like Bob Jones and Micheal Fay and thus our  now privatized trading Banks like ANZ ASB have started making record profits, while our propertys values  have   started rising and rising  to record values. Along with the mortgages which have  got higher and higher to buy the over priced property.

    #1719842
    halcyon
    Member
    Member since: May 4, 2014
    Topics: 8
    Replies: 4951
    halcyon

    Thank you for that information paulinem. However, it does not provide answers to my questions.

    The reason I asked those questions is due to a belief that to implement the method of creating money as you suggest would have costs for the country. I seem to remember that during the period you refer to the NZ Government devalued the NZ Pound by 29%. That could be wrong but there was definitely a serious devaluation.

    Secondly, NZ had a protected market. One could only buy locally made goods that were dearer in price than what was available overseas and were of a shoddy nature.

    I also noticed that when the Fed started Quantitative Easing during the last economic down turn that the $US softened markedly against the $NZ. Therefore I wonder if that would happen to our dollar if we increase the money supply.

    That is why I was hoping someone could answer those questions.

    Remember, the world is a different place than in Micky Savage’s day.

    It's ok if you disagree with me. I can't force you to be right.

    #1719846
    paulinem
    Member
    Member since: July 8, 2006
    Topics: 9
    Replies: 993
    paulinem

    Halycon in a protected market we  repaired etc ( vehicles etc )what  we had instead of spending valuable overseas funds on new goods we wanted overseas. Today is a  throw away society and we have large areas of land taking up  unwanted disposed vehicle graveyards These vehicles  could have been repaired instead of being thrown away.   These overseas  vehicle we purchase today is the reason we borrowed  billions, of debt for our  future generations.

    I have no  problem getting overseas funds for modern  equipment  vehicles etc required in industry and agriculture. But do we really need the overseas purchase of  so many other private use recreational vehicles. Could we not instead  encourage a society that repairs and fixes what we have.  Surely the employment this would create alone in repairs is worth fixing up what we have already.

    #1719847
    paulinem
    Member
    Member since: July 8, 2006
    Topics: 9
    Replies: 993
    paulinem

    As far as devalued NZ dollar not pound we changed in 1967  to dollar? ( I think)…bit long ago Halycon to try and remember  the economic problems of that time etc, Such as why etc  you think  thee NZ dollar devalued seriously -there could have been a good and important reason why it was allowed to drop re exports and imports.  So Halycon we cannot  criticise really   when or IF this occurred as neither of  us remember all the circumstances of the economy at that time in our lives.

Viewing 10 posts - 6,111 through 6,120 (of 6,674 total)

The topic ‘Politics Today’ is closed to new replies.

Advertisement
 
Join Free.  Register for newsletter updates & complete your membership for full site access.  Welcome & Enjoy!

Register Free today and go in the draw to win a $50 gift card!

Close X  
GrownUps

Register

Join 165,000 GrownUps for Free. Register now to receive our regular email newsletters to keep you up to date & complete your membership to access all areas of the site. We can’t wait to meet you. Enjoy!

Please tick the box to continue:

GrownUps

Excellent, you're all signed up for the GrownUps newsletter!

An email has been sent to the email address you provided for when you're ready to finish setting up your user profile.

We hope to see you soon!