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The "Causes" of escalating Poverty in NZ

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This topic contains 192 replies, has 22 voices, and was last updated by Profile photo of huiatahi huiatahi 1 hour, 27 minutes ago.

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  • #1651653
    Profile photo of jens
    jens
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    TedE  –  thanks, yes  –

    but Roosevelt’s  measures were incomplete by not  “democratizing” the  functions  of  “economic royalty and princes”, and were actually  resulting  in even more  dependency  on them  to keep  his widening and raising  consumption  measures and  abilities sustainable.

    That  is somewhat  similar to what happened  here  up  to 30  years ago, –

    unfortunately with the  inevitable  outcome, and the  reactions to  this  being still  inadequate on  democratizing the  wealth creation and ownership  functions of   economic “princes” and potential monopoly totalitarians.

    No, we  don’t  want to  keep  “circling  around ” on  trying  again  what  has been tried  already,  so  why  not  democratize  the wealth  creation and ownership  responsibility function  of the economic “princes” and  potential  monopoly  totalitarians ?

    What  do you think of that, TedE ?

     

    #1651662
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    Must have missed something…tell me how Roosevelt was able to influence or cause escalating poverty in nz again and when was that? 🙂

    #1651805
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    jens
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    Well, critic  – while in  NZ  Roosevelt’s words  were not used, both NZ and and  the USA ended up  by increasingly financing their  internal welfare  maintenance  with the  help of Keynesian  credit  creation  – while  trying to evade  the austerity  of  adequate  saving  for  debt  repayment..

    This led to the need  of  “rogernomics” here in 1984, and the U.S.  changing into  one of the  biggest  debtor  nation in the  world from being the  biggest  lender nation since   WW2.

    The only reason no  serious  inflation has  resulted  from  substantial “quantitative  easing”  in the U.S. so far  –  is because  it is still  considered as  a debt  to be repaid(?)  –  and  not  as “debt free”  credit.

    All this  is  evidence that  borrowing  for welfare  consumption at a  higher  rate than what profitable  productivity  can deliver for  debt  repayment – excessive poverty alleviation  subsidies  become a poverty escalation  cause.

    • This reply was modified 6 days ago by Profile photo of jens jens.
    • This reply was modified 6 days ago by Profile photo of jens jens.
    #1652190
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    This led to the need of “rogernomics” here in 1984,

    The only reason your class of person keep insisting or try so hard to rationalize a false need for rogernomics is that you are ignorant not only of the Laws.

    But also the various interests the People had in their investments (that which any investor would expect to have)
    Cultured Ignorance that also allowed legal obligations associated with fiduciary relationships to be disregarded (yea I know “all” above your head jens)

    The government were unable to treat the accumulated equities and associated rights as their own “budget material” until after it was scripted in such a manner as for them to do so (for pecuniary advantage of course) …. nothing to do with a failed pig farmer who they used like a car salesperson at all really.

    Your Rogernomics was Simply a catchy word used to disguise the theft and laundering of interests in property initiated by those serving in positions of trust… Nothing more 🙂

    #1652345
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    jens
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    According to my understanding, “rogernomic” reform  was necessary to  prevent  a looming failure in meeting  financial commitments.

    Can anyone  understand and  explain  with an example  what  critic is  talking about  ?

    #1652390
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    According to my understanding, “rogernomic” reform was necessary to prevent a looming failure in meeting financial commitments.

    Several factors here jens … So lets separate the issues and put in place clear boundaries.

    Firstly … “looming failure in meeting financial commitments” sounds an awful lot like “INCOMPETENCE” and I suggest that Any party serving in a position of trust that delivered such incompetence should have been disqualified from serving in such positions of trust ever again .. I call it reasonable and logical accounting

    The next part is about boundaries… I have tried before to explain that the government was a steward prior to rogernomics but became a proprietor as the result of the creative accounting/penmanship) or Criminal laundering of “our” interests in “our” investments in infrastructure… but it didn’t sink in.

    It is fairly common for “ANY THIEF” to justify their behavior in terms of their own situation or perception of need … “I was broke” is a fairly common one but theft is theft regardless of the thieves justifications…. Two other issues regarding the theft is the theft was done by servants which makes it more serious and there was a fiduciary relationship …

    There is no doubt in my mind that a serious crime is being overlooked for the purpose of retaining the pecuniary advantage secured by the serious criminal activities but.

    You like savings plans jens…. I reckon you wouldn´t just roll over (as you have) if the bank decided to pay its debts off with your savings and then charged you for their good efforts + GST and the only difference I can see is that your name is on your savings account

    Its almost a credibility issue 🙂

    #1652429
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    jens
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    Well critic – the  economic “incompetence” of  the government before  1984 was  entirely  due to the  people  overwhelmingly voting  in 1975  in favor  of  more  “hand-to-mouth”  NZ Super at a younger  age(60), and  happy to give up  on a savings  plan that in principle even might have made it sustainable , just as say,  anyone  can retire  already at age 50,  by  having  accumulated  enough profitable  wealth  ownership.

    Sorry –  want  see the  news now  –  cheers, critic.

    #1652475
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    jens
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    Furthermore, critic  –  a democratic government’s  rule or “stewardship” is  based  on  whatever  legislation has been accepted  by majority  approval, and this  legislation permits  the  sale of assets  for  a  price  into  government coffers.

    There  has been  no secrecy, “theft”, or “money  laundering” involved  with the  electricity assets  sold,  and  if a government thinking like you  is elected, the assets  can be  bought  back  again into  government run public  ownership – although I think  just  taking them  back without  compensation can only be  thought  of  by a thorough communist,  who like a “flat earther” still  fiercely  believes in what  has been  found  and  revealed  itself as  “pie in the  sky”.

    While   Ponzi scheme  tricksters do exist,  paying dividends (benefits?) out of  the capital (not the  earnings of it) they  promised  to  invest, this  does not apply  to honest normal banking at all,  and  you are totally  confused  in nonsense  like  “banks  paying off  their debts  with my money and then  charging me  for their  services + GST….” –

    unless you  come  up with a  practical  example  of  such a  sequence  of events.

    #1652489
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    Well critic – the economic “incompetence” of the government before 1984 was entirely due to the people overwhelmingly voting in 1975 in favor of more “hand-to-mouth” NZ S……

    Then the problem is with the electoral office not the People voting because the purpose of the electoral system is to nominate a party that contracts for the job of governing… Any other Mandate should be a separate vote as a budget is normally prepared one would anticipate that such a budget is given a credibility test ….

    On the subject of governing… some motors have “governors” which are intended to protect the motor from overreaching etc
    These governors are a simple device that do not require a separate budget nor do they take control of the motor in such a manner as to be able to dispose of it…

    Wouldn’t it be good to have a government that actually knew how to govern?
    You enjoy trying to hand on the responsibility to the voters but often as not the voters amount to little more than half the total population….
    The arrogant governments of today cannot govern themselves let alone the nation and that is why they sold it- they are just stupid criminals jens that cannot govern their own behavior… 🙂

    #1652495
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    jens
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    We are all just  humans, critic –

    subject  to the laws of  physics, and cannot  create  anything out of  nothing.

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