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This topic contains 2040 replies, has 38 voices, and was last updated by Profile photo of halcyon halcyon 3 minutes ago.

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  • #1643102
    Profile photo of mommabear70
    mommabear70
    Member
    Member since: February 20, 2017
    Topics: 0
    Replies: 340

    What part of existing law do people not understand?

    To change existing law, then legislation needs to be changed.

    The existing law on income tax was passed by National, Greens and NZ First.
    On projected numbers, for Labour to pass legislation to change that existing law, they would need votes from Greens and NZ First.

    Greens and NZ First voted to enact the existing law and nothing I’ve read to date says one or both parties would withdraw their support for the existing law on income tax. Thus Labour simply do not have the numbers to change that law.

    #1643105
    Profile photo of gabyone
    gabyone
    Member
    Member since: November 13, 2008
    Topics: 1
    Replies: 2246

    Mommabear,  I think you are persisting in spreading a lie . No where except in Nationals lie about taxation can I find any figures to substantiate your claims. Do you honestly expect me to believe that if Labour wins the election my household i.e. me as a live alone on Super will be receiving $184 less per week ?

    As a floating voter ,this election I cannot even consider voting for National when such blatant lies continue to to be spread by their avid supporters. Believe it or not but in the past I have belonged to & supported the National party. Sadly muck like you are spreading does more harm than good. So this election I will not be aligned with such rabid untruth.  I guess by Saturday I have to decide who I shall give my vote & several parties who may support National need to be ruled out also. It is sickening to see such deplorable behaviour from a major party.

     

    Gabyone Auckland region

    #1643106
    Profile photo of arandar
    arandar
    Member
    Member since: November 23, 2009
    Topics: 54
    Replies: 10033

    And I am not going to vote for more of the same; more suicides, more homelessness, more children dying of preventable diseases, more pensioners living in caravan parks, more families living in cars, more overcrowded hospitals and overworked medical staff, more cows, more dirty rivers, more e.coli in our drinking water supplies, more roads to nowhere much.

    And more damned lies. No. That’s not my NZ.

    🌊Arandar🏄🏽‍♀️

    #1643107
    Profile photo of kiwichick
    kiwichick
    Member
    Member since: May 9, 2008
    Topics: 7
    Replies: 3809

    Jacinda has had a mammoth task and  I doubt there are any pollies in the country that could have done more than she has in such a short time.

    It’s do or die for Bill, only 22% voted for him when he was defeated by Helen Clark.

    He holds the record for the lowest polling PM, not a legacy anybody would want.

    Hes probably a decent bloke but PM material? not convinced, but better than his 2nd in command.

    I voted today, it will be fascinating to see how things evolve on Saturday.

    I just  hope the voter turn out is bigger than ever before.

    #1643115
    Profile photo of mommabear70
    mommabear70
    Member
    Member since: February 20, 2017
    Topics: 0
    Replies: 340

    Gabyone
    There are no lies in my statements.

    You say “Do you honestly expect me to believe that if Labour wins the election my household i.e. me as a live alone on Super will be receiving $184 less per week ?
    No I don’t, but I never said you would. What I did say was Labour plus NZ First’s election promises would cost every NZ household $184 a week for three years. That’s taxpayers money. Some is your money and some is my money. You may not care how the tax you’ve already paid us spent, but many of us really really care. A lot of that money will be wasted on totally unworkable policies like the water and river thing and heaps more on policies designed to destroy the economy, but I digress, that’s another story.

    Or perhaps you’d have me believe those parties’ policies would be funded out of invisible money? Hopefully The Greens are kept out of government because they truly believe in invisible money.
    National’s policies,  if they had the numbers to govern alone, would cost every NZ household $30 a week for three years.
    That’s quite a difference.
    Then you say “Nowhere….can I find any figures to substantiate your claims. Do you mean you don’t know how much Labour and NZ First will be spending to fund their election promises? If that’s what you mean, then it’s been widely published and verified by their own economists. Labour’s total is $23 billion and NZ First’s is $26 billion. Incidentally, National’s is $8.3 billion. These figures assume that each party spends what it has promised, and doesn’t take into account possible changes arising from negotiations to form a government.

    I’m intrigued by your choice phrases like ‘blatant lies’, ‘muck spreading’, ‘rabid untruth’ and ‘deplorable behaviour’.  Not one of those phrases can in all honesty be attached to the above facts.

    No lies, no muck, no untruths, no deplorable behaviour. Just the truth.

    Or could you be annoyed with my “The only way your household can avoid this cost is by moving to another country.”? I stand by that truthful statement also. Many thousands could be moving to Australia as many did the last time Labour was in Government.

    Are you questioning the validity and honesty of existing law, more especially in relation to the income tax debate?

    A mere four months ago, Greens and NZ First both supported National’s Family Package and voted with National to enact the (now) existing law on income tax.
    For either Greens or NZ First or both to shortly vote to change that legislation back to where it was, speaks volumes on deplorable behaviour. Why would you want people in your team that might change their stance at the drop of a hat?
    What sort of people change their stance at the drop of a hat?
    Greedy untrustworthy people.

    #1643116
    Profile photo of doogie
    doogie
    Member
    Member since: March 27, 2006
    Topics: 10
    Replies: 5493

    Interesting on the AM Show this morning Chris Trotter saying after nine years the Labour Party sent Jacinda out to sell a lousy products.

    Just what I was saying in a recent post.

    • This reply was modified 3 weeks, 5 days ago by Profile photo of doogie doogie.
    #1643118
    Profile photo of drlivingstone
    drlivingstone
    Member
    Member since: October 22, 2006
    Topics: 285
    Replies: 33433

    Regretably  The Nats Bill English discovered poverty last week after nine years of denial along with housing crisis affordable homes,& homelessness  and like those elusive Northland bridges they are still waiting for could lose it just as quickly.As for Chris Trotter his utterances are taken with a grain of salt.

    Dr.Livingstone
    Peoples Republic Of Christchurch

    #1643123
    Profile photo of mommabear70
    mommabear70
    Member
    Member since: February 20, 2017
    Topics: 0
    Replies: 340

    Labour will hit the ground running in their first 100 days. All this from their website:
    Make the first year of tertiary education or training fees free from January 1, 2018.
    Increase student allowances and living cost loans by $50 a week from January 1, 2018.
    Pass the Healthy Homes Guarantee Bill, requiring all rentals to be warm and dry
    Ban overseas speculators from buying existing houses
    Issue an instruction to Housing New Zealand to stop the state house sell-off
    Begin work to establish the Affordable Housing Authority and begin the KiwiBuild programme
    Legislate to pass the Families Package, including the Winter Fuel Payment, Best Start and increases to Paid Parental Leave, to take effect from 1 July 2018
    Set up a Ministerial Inquiry in order to fix our mental health crisis
    Introduce legislation to make medicinal cannabis available for people with terminal illnesses or in chronic pain
    Resume contributions to the New Zealand Superannuation Fund to help safeguard the provision of universal superannuation at age 65
    Introduce legislation to set a child poverty reduction target and to change the Public Finance Act so the Budget reports progress on reducing child poverty
    Increase the minimum wage to $16.50 an hour, to take effect from 1 April 2018, and introduce legislation to improve fairness in the workplace.
    Establish the Tax Working Group
    Establish the Pike River Recovery Agency and assign a responsible Minister
    Set up an inquiry into the abuse of children in state care
    Hold a Clean Waters Summit on cleaning up our rivers and lakes
    Set the zero carbon emissions goal and begin setting up the independent Climate Commission.

    100 days from 23 September 2017 is 1 January 2018. According to the Parliamentary calendar, there are 24 sitting days between 23 September and 31 December.

    Let’s assume that there are no protracted coalition negotiations and Labour waltzes into office on 24 September. The first sitting day is Tuesday 26 September so over the weekend the flunkies have shifted all the offices etc that need to be shifted and everyone is ready to roll, all the new Labour Ministers are fully briefed on everything they need to know to pass all this new legislation.

    So there are 24 sitting days in which to complete the list of 17 Labour promised deliverables.
    However, some are easy:
    “Issue an instruction to Housing New Zealand” – a few minutes writing an email. Tick. Nothing has to actually happen, just issue an instruction.
    “Begin work to establish the Affordable Housing Authority”. Send a memo to someone. Tick. Nothing achieved but something has begun.
    “Set up a Ministerial Inquiry” Ditto, Tick.

    Three done and it is not even morning tea time yet.

    “Establish the Tax Working Group”. This one will take a little longer, people to consult and terms of reference to write but this does not require House sitting days, so should be doable. Tick.
    “Establish the Pike River Recovery Agency” Ditto – Tick.
    “Set up an inquiry into the abuse of children”. Again, so long as some paperwork is started, they can claim a tick for this, Labour is not promising the inquiry will be complete, just set up.
    Going well so far.

    “Set the zero carbon emissions goal and begin setting up …” Jacinda has already publically set the zero goal so another tick and a “begin setting” with no result is another easy win.”Hold a Clean Waters Summit” This one may be a bit more of a challenge unless the experts are all at a loose end during the end of the year silly season, no academics with exams to set or mark. They actually have to have a summit meeting, but I guess they could just use people from Government departments to have a “Summit” which decides more work is required so, generously, let’s say another tick.

    That leaves nine items on the list, all of which (I think) will require Bills, Regulations and Acts to be written, passed through the Committee stages, First and Second Readings etc all in 24 sitting days.
    What sort of quality legislation can we hope for? The Healthy Homes Guarantee Bill, requiring all rentals to be warm and dry. “Healthy”, “warm” and “dry” will all need defining. The inspection regime will need to be set up etc.

    Perhaps I’m old fashioned but I would rather that legislation was well thought through, not rushed to meet some arbitrary soundbite target.
    But there you go, Labour have promised it’ll be done by 01 January 2018.
    Even Kiwibuild houses might be rolling off the assembly line. Pity they didn’t put ‘Buy land for Kiwibuild houses on’ on the list.

    I wonder which day will be the first to kick off the rolling strikes.

    #1643126
    Profile photo of gabyone
    gabyone
    Member
    Member since: November 13, 2008
    Topics: 1
    Replies: 2246

    Mommabear, Just like Muldoon once said there are 3 budgets that can be produced by from set of figures and I suggest your supposed set of figures belong in the one produced to decieve the voters.

    If you are happy with the current treatment of the poorest in this country then you must be one of the greedy older folk who do not give a toss about anyone but themselves.I am happy to vote against my own interests to try & improve the lot of those struggling to survive in this selfish world.

     

     

    Gabyone Auckland region

    #1643129
    Profile photo of mommabear70
    mommabear70
    Member
    Member since: February 20, 2017
    Topics: 0
    Replies: 340

    Gabyone

    You can suggest what you like. The figures I’ve quoted are facts. Go check all parties websites, look up the Dept of Stats for number of households. Check out all released policy promises and costings. When you have all the facts, you may wish to reconsider exactly who are deceiving the voters.

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